WTB: Santa Maria Novella Shave Cream

Baloosh · Post by **Baloosh** » Sat May 30, 2009 5:36 am

OldSaw wrote: I have been using Santa Maria Novella for a couple of years now and I can assure you that it is not the same as Proraso. I have posted a lot about it, here, here and here.

However, if you are the kind of person that has a very lite beard and can not tell the difference between an average product and a premium product, then save your money, it isn't for you. To the untrained ear, a Stradivarius is just another fiddle... OK, I said most of this in the links.

Way to alienate yourself to an entire forum.

Edit: And just for reference, I've tried all 3 products: Omega soap, Proraso soap, and the SMN soap. They're all 3 so similar across the board, in scent, behavior and efficacy, that I personally don't feel that the egregious price difference between the SMN and the other two is justified. If you (a general you, not OldSaw particularly) feel differently, more power to you. That's what's so great about having myriad options in wetshaving products.

OldSaw · Post by **OldSaw** » Sat May 30, 2009 10:06 pm

diggity wrote:
OldSaw wrote:
fisherc wrote:The formulae are essentially the same with a slight difference in scent (mostly the amount of camphor/menthol). The Martelli's of Firenze helped the current family who own SMN expand in to other cosmetic products over a decade ago. The Martelli family has an OEM business (similar to Creightons in the UK) and they make cream/soap for different brands (SMN, Omega, CO Bigelow, etc). You can argue as to whether or not the formulae is "eaxctly" the same and maybe it is not but for all practical purposes I see no difference in the shave efficacy among these different "brands" of the same product. Whether the price of one vs another is "worth it" is likely a different discussion.

Chris
I have been using Santa Maria Novella for a couple of years now and I can assure you that it is not the same as Proraso. I have posted a lot about it, here, here and here.

However, if you are the kind of person that has a very lite beard and can not tell the difference between an average product and a premium product, then save your money, it isn't for you. To the untrained ear, a Stradivarius is just another fiddle... OK, I said most of this in the links.
Why don't you mosey on back over there and post some more? It doesn't matter to me where you have posted your opinions. There are proper ways to express them whether or not you do it here or on another shave forum. The fact that you made your comments above (I have bolded them) to a few of the most experienced and respected gents on this bored made your opinion to me, invalid.

Excuse me but my comments were not directed toward any individuals, but more of a general statement about certain types of people. I don't understand why you are being so rude to me about this matter. I am simply expressing my opinion and have been a member here as well as the other forums for a while now. I don't consider myself to be any less knowledgeable than many other seasoned members.

diggity · Post by **diggity** » Sun May 31, 2009 12:37 am

Your comments seemed to be directed towards a few members here, like it or not and were very arrogant. I just call it how I see it. You are excused.

OldSaw · Post by **OldSaw** » Sun May 31, 2009 12:33 pm

OK guys, I ran this past a few others that I know and respect and they pointed out how my initial comments could have been taken in a way that I had not intended.

So, I am sorry for creating a nuisance on this topic. It was not my intention to be contrary for the sake of being contrary. I can also see how my low post count might give some pause to my opinion. In my haste while making the initial post, I figured that my join date and the post count in the links would have counted for something. Also in my haste, I used links to avoid copying and pasting, etc. and I also quoted myself from another thread out of context, which in retrospect was probably not such a good idea.

Certain products have strong opinions about them and apparently this is one of them. I obviously have a strong opinion toward liking it. However, to say that I have alienated an entire forum is a bit of a stretch. I doubt that most people have even read this thread. Besides there are many members here that are also members on the other forums that I am in good standing with.

Even though I don't post here often and prefer to spend my time on another forum, does not mean I want to have bad relations. So please accept my apology and I look forward to more positive posting in the future, whether it be here or at B&B.

Thanks for listening.

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Sun May 31, 2009 12:51 pm

Dennis, I wasn't offended by it, so it was inaccurate for anyone to have presumed that I was, but there's been no harm done here, no foul, and I can't imagine, any hard feelings. You're a good fellow, in my opinion, and I must say that I understood what you were attempting to say initially. Where else in the world do we get a chance to interact with other guys who are passionate about shaving cream, brushes, razors, and all of the other stuff we are passionate about. Best regards,

Churchill · Post by **Churchill** » Sun May 31, 2009 1:00 pm

Dennis,
I also apologize for my comments on the other forum.
We hope to see more of you around here as you are an experienced wetshaver and can add alot of good content to our community.
Please come around more often.
Take care.

fisherc · Post by **fisherc** » Sun May 31, 2009 1:35 pm

Dennis:

No worries. Personally I was not offended in any way. We all have our passions around various products for various reasons and far be it from me or anyone else to judge what works best for any given individual. Personally I was simply trying to shed some light on the facts between the manufacturing and business relationship between Martelli and SMN. I was not makin gany judgment on the "value" or "worth" nor on whether or not there is a difference between these producers. The corollary between Creightons and the three T's is very appropriate and we know that many feel there is a difference between each of theT's even though they are produced by the same lab/mfr. It would stand to reason that some who have used Omega, Proraso, CO Bigelow and SMN have an opinion about the efficacy of one vs the other.

In all the time that I have spent around wetshaving and skincare in general I have learned that there is no universal truth regarding products, techniques, etc. It's all very personal and what works for one may not work for another. And "worth" or "value" is all in the eyes of the beholder.

best regards,
Chris

Teiste · Post by **Teiste** » Sun May 31, 2009 1:45 pm

OldSaw wrote:
fisherc wrote:The formulae are essentially the same with a slight difference in scent (mostly the amount of camphor/menthol). The Martelli's of Firenze helped the current family who own SMN expand in to other cosmetic products over a decade ago. The Martelli family has an OEM business (similar to Creightons in the UK) and they make cream/soap for different brands (SMN, Omega, CO Bigelow, etc). You can argue as to whether or not the formulae is "eaxctly" the same and maybe it is not but for all practical purposes I see no difference in the shave efficacy among these different "brands" of the same product. Whether the price of one vs another is "worth it" is likely a different discussion.

Chris
I have been using Santa Maria Novella for a couple of years now and I can assure you that it is not the same as Proraso. I have posted a lot about it, here, here and here.

However, if you are the kind of person that has a very lite beard and can not tell the difference between an average product and a premium product, then save your money, it isn't for you. To the untrained ear, a Stradivarius is just another fiddle... OK, I said most of this in the links.

Of course is not the same than Proraso.Its the same that old Omega shaving soap formula with the lanolin on it(Omega doesnt includes lanolin anymore on its ingredients...too bad).SMN is made in the same factory than Proraso and Omega.Im sorry to say but this is just old omega shaving cream with a gold price(and not even a nice packing by the way)
I bet that the italians are happy to see how you pay 36 euros for a cream that with other name cost you 5,but hey,if works for you,you know better than anybody what to do with your money...and by your statement about the Stradivarius it seems to me that you have a degree in "wet shaving" and you have the absolute truth..its sad that you made such an statement like that and cant distinguish then same product with two different names...

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:01 pm

Teiste, maybe this is why we have so many brands of ...well, everything! Some are of course, the same thing. Butter, bread, gasoline, yada yada yada! Let's celebrate the differences and enjoy them, and let's continue to have good-natured and honorable discussions about them.

Baloosh · Post by **Baloosh** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:02 pm

As someone else posted, no harm, no foul. You apologized, so it's all good.

Hope to see you around here more, since in my opinion there's room on all the wetshaving forums for everyone... despite each one's individual "vibe" and way of doing things.

Teiste · Post by **Teiste** » Sun May 31, 2009 2:19 pm

brothers wrote:Teiste, maybe this is why we have so many brands of ...well, everything! Some are of course, the same thing. Butter, bread, gasoline, yada yada yada! Let's celebrate the differences and enjoy them, and let's continue to have good-natured and honorable discussions about them.

You are totally right Gary and I do celebrate that.I just dont like when people try to make look others like "unlearned" and make everybody believe that his word is the absolute truth and if you dont agree with him you are basically "stupid".Fortunately he apologized so is all good.
I have to said that I did try SMN a couple years ago when I got it in Barcelona.I was so happy when I bought and so mad when I discovered it that it was the same formula than Omega.I think that I paid 36 euros for that "Omega rebranded" and once and no more,lesson learned.The only good thing about SMN is its scent,just great,but Cella or Valobra are better soft soap/soap for less money.

diggity · Post by **diggity** » Sun May 31, 2009 5:19 pm

No harm, no foul, Dennis. Glad to see you around here

OldSaw · Post by **OldSaw** » Sun May 31, 2009 7:07 pm

Thanks for all the positive replies guys. Just a follow up, this is something I posted today at B&B.

As far as the Stradivarius comparison thing goes, it was not ever intended as a slam on anyone's judgment. I know I certainly could not tell the difference with my tin ear. I probably should have used a better analogy like telling the difference between Coke, Pepsi and RC. Some people can tell the difference, others can't and some just don't care. So it's not necessarily a judgment thing. Everyone's skin chemistry and beard type is different as well as the water in different locations.

What really strikes me as odd is no matter how hard I try to like Proraso, it just doesn't work for me. Omega (the version that I have with lanolin), on the other hand, is much closer to SMN on my face and I could see a viable argument for its similarity.

I think the first time I used the Stradivarius remark was in a thread about Williams shave soap and Mitchel's Woolfat. I know there are a lot of Williams fans out there, but I sometimes take cheap shots at it, all in good fun of course. Sometimes it is difficult to convey the humor in an internet conversation.

Anyway, I'm not sure how much time I will have for any forums starting tomorrow as I will be on a pretty busy schedule for the next few months. I'll try to check in more often. Maybe a good old boar versus badger brush discussion will be fun.

diggity · Post by **diggity** » Sun May 31, 2009 7:25 pm

OldSaw wrote:Thanks for all the positive replies guys. Just a follow up, this is something I posted today at B&B.

As far as the Stradivarius comparison thing goes, it was not ever intended as a slam on anyone's judgment. I know I certainly could not tell the difference with my tin ear. I probably should have used a better analogy like telling the difference between Coke, Pepsi and RC. Some people can tell the difference, others can't and some just don't care. So it's not necessarily a judgment thing. Everyone's skin chemistry and beard type is different as well as the water in different locations.

What really strikes me as odd is no matter how hard I try to like Proraso, it just doesn't work for me. Omega (the version that I have with lanolin), on the other hand, is much closer to SMN on my face and I could see a viable argument for its similarity.
I think the first time I used the Stradivarius remark was in a thread about Williams shave soap and Mitchel's Woolfat. I know there are a lot of Williams fans out there, but I sometimes take cheap shots at it, all in good fun of course. Sometimes it is difficult to convey the humor in an internet conversation.

Anyway, I'm not sure how much time I will have for any forums starting tomorrow as I will be on a pretty busy schedule for the next few months. I'll try to check in more often. Maybe a good old boar versus badger brush discussion will be fun.

No doubt that discussion will take more than a few months to play itself out

bernards66 · Post by **bernards66** » Sun May 31, 2009 7:30 pm

Dennis, Yes, that's always a jolly one. Stop by when you can.
Regards,
Gordon

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:49 am

Gordon, "Jolly" might be one possible description.

Anyway, I won't start that topic, but I'll certainly read it, with one eye shut.

John 5 · Post by **John 5** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 9:19 am

OldSaw wrote:Thanks for all the positive replies guys. Just a follow up, this is something I posted today at B&B.

As far as the Stradivarius comparison thing goes, it was not ever intended as a slam on anyone's judgment. I know I certainly could not tell the difference with my tin ear. I probably should have used a better analogy like telling the difference between Coke, Pepsi and RC. Some people can tell the difference, others can't and some just don't care. So it's not necessarily a judgment thing. Everyone's skin chemistry and beard type is different as well as the water in different locations.

What really strikes me as odd is no matter how hard I try to like Proraso, it just doesn't work for me. Omega (the version that I have with lanolin), on the other hand, is much closer to SMN on my face and I could see a viable argument for its similarity.
I think the first time I used the Stradivarius remark was in a thread about Williams shave soap and Mitchel's Woolfat. I know there are a lot of Williams fans out there, but I sometimes take cheap shots at it, all in good fun of course. Sometimes it is difficult to convey the humor in an internet conversation.

Anyway, I'm not sure how much time I will have for any forums starting tomorrow as I will be on a pretty busy schedule for the next few months. I'll try to check in more often. Maybe a good old boar versus badger brush discussion will be fun.

Dennis, no harm done, and you state that others you trust pointed out to you how your original statement could be misconstrued, so I won't harp on about that. That Stradivarius remark really hit home to me, for while I'm no professional musician by any means, the hobby which takes most of my spare time is playing around with guitars and the piano. I've been playing classical piano since my post toddler days, and have a collection of classical guitars almost approaching my razor collection in quantity. I've followed that whole Stradivarius mythical status ordeal for as long as I could remember. I'd only heard of someone using the Strad is a fiddle to the laymen' comparasion once, and it was by whom is arguably the most pompous, pretentious and insufferable man possibly alive today, the literary critic Harold Bloom. It rubbed be the wrong way when I first heard it then, and it struck a cord much the same way now, even more so since at first glance it appeared squarely aimed at Chris F. and Gordon. But again, no harm done, and look forward to your continued posts.

OldSaw · Post by **OldSaw** » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:55 pm

John 5 wrote:Dennis, no harm done, and you state that others you trust pointed out to you how your original statement could be misconstrued, so I won't harp on about that. That Stradivarius remark really hit home to me, for while I'm no professional musician by any means, the hobby which takes most of my spare time is playing around with guitars and the piano. I've been playing classical piano since my post toddler days, and have a collection of classical guitars almost approaching my razor collection in quantity. I've followed that whole Stradivarius mythical status ordeal for as long as I could remember. I'd only heard of someone using the Strad is a fiddle to the laymen' comparasion once, and it was by whom is arguably the most pompous, pretentious and insufferable man possibly alive today, the literary critic Harold Bloom. It rubbed be the wrong way when I first heard it then, and it struck a cord much the same way now, even more so since at first glance it appeared squarely aimed at Chris F. and Gordon. But again, no harm done, and look forward to your continued posts.

Funny thing is, the first time I referred to the Strad was while sitting at the computer and trying to think of an analogy and the first thing I saw was my wife's violin. Now if I had been drinking a Coke at the time...