Nancy Boy

Leisureguy · Post by **Leisureguy** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:52 am

Gordon is right: if we want to discuss Nancy Boy products in the cultural context, it probably should be done here.

I have to say that I like the way that Nancy Boy promotes their products. I find it entertaining and something different than the usual corporate effort to---at all costs---offend no one. (Of course, I remember developing software products for the IBM PC product line that product managers would insist must run on ALL IBM PCs, regardless of the size of the user base---and then the struggles to make the software run on the PCjr, a computer that IBM relatively quickly dropped.)

That Nancy Boy more or less excludes homophobes from the potential customer base is a drawback, but then they may not want to sell to people who don't like who they (the Nancy Boy company) are. I don't see that as totally unreasonable.

As mores change, the transition can be rocky. We've seen that in other areas as well---race used to be much more important than it is now, and potential customers could be offended by the presence of a non-Caucasian in an advertisement in other than subservient role. Brave companies eventually started offering integrated ads, which doubtless offended many at the time, but nowadays we simply accept that.

Seamaster · Post by **Seamaster** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:04 am

Couldn't agree more.

iancevans · Post by **iancevans** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:52 am

One quick thing. A lot of people wanted to know "why" Nancy Boy is open about "their" sexual preferences... As though prominently displaying sexual preferences is somehow unusual in marketing for men's grooming!

Here's text from an old Burma-Shave ad (with seductive picture of lady):

"See this outfit / Don't you scoff / You know where / She takes it off"

And:

"Broken romance / Stated fully / She went wild / When he / Went wooly / Burma Shave"

Then there's all the Gillette commercials with a guy shaving while a beautiful woman watches and perhaps rubs his face afterwards.

I got a free sample of Shave Shack shampoo. Take a look at the image on the bottle:

http://www.shaving-shack.com/shop/catal ... -2483.html

So, really, implicit endorsement of specific sexual preferences is the norm in men's grooming products. What's not normal is endorsement of homosexual preferences.

So if you find Nancy Boy's marketing "alienating" or off-putting, imagine how gay men must feel when they watch a Gillette commercial.

"Why?" Why not? Sex is everywhere in marketing and no one even bats an eye until it's gay sex.

Leisureguy · Post by **Leisureguy** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 12:05 pm

Excellent point! And of course much grooming and grooming products are done with an eye to sexual attractiveness. Particularly true of the young, of course.

Post by **drmoss_ca** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 1:06 pm

But as you get older you realise that sex in the head is more potent than in any other body part. None of us are immune.

Chris

diggity · Post by **diggity** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:33 pm

I really don't see any gay tones in their advertising or item descriptions. Their newsletter on the other hand is a bit different, but whatever. The heart of the matter is that they are located in an area in San Francisco that does have a lot of homosexuals, however, the store itself is quite professional and doesn't promote any type of sexuality. They are quite professional, knowledgeable about their products, and do make some mean soap and laundry detergent.... Plus, who really cares? One could say that this whole shaving business is very metrosexual anyway...I mean...collecting shave soap and cream like it's going out of business!

Leisureguy · Post by **Leisureguy** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:36 pm

Well, sadly, some ARE going out of business---and we stock up against reformulations!

GA Russell · Post by **GA Russell** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:47 pm

iancevans wrote: Sex is everywhere in marketing and no one even bats an eye until it's gay sex.

Not so fast, Ian! Actually there are quite a few of us who object to what is called our "sex-drenched society".

iancevans · Post by **iancevans** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:15 pm

I almost qualified that with "hardly anyone", but fair enough! Red herring anyway--I meant to be focusing on the banality of expression of sexual preferences, not some of the salacious (and often offensive) advertising that is common these days.

To wit: If you see a commercial with a husband and a wife, you know (partially) what their sexual preferences are. No big deal. The "Tested on boyfriends" bit isn't a big deal, either.

iancevans · Post by **iancevans** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 3:19 pm

And I don't mean anything pejorative by "hardly anyone"--that was a purely sociological point!

Hoos · Post by **Hoos** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 6:24 pm

We don't have an agenda. Any more than there's a "straight" agenda.

In fact, a good number of us are just trying to live our lives without getting killed.

But since this is a shaving forum, I'll just point out that straight men aren't the only people who shave.

Nancy Boy? I've tried their products and don't care for them. I don't find the name or the sense of humor either particularly offensive or funny. But I applaud them for having the spine to be who they are and to also put out great products backed by even better customer service. That's all anyone really needs to care about. But if, by intent or by accident, they bring a little more attention to a worthwhile concern, I'm all for that, too.[/code]

Post by **Sam** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 6:34 pm

Moderator's note: So that Hoos' comment about the agenda makes sense, about 4 or 5 posts prior to his were deleted. This is not the place to discuss whether homosexuality is right, wrong, moral, immoral, amoral or to give one's views about its place in society. If you want to comment on the marketing aspect without, they do have a marketing strategy and part of it may play upon the catchiness of the phrase 'Nancy Boy" and the whole metrosexuality term as applied to men and grooming.

To the two gentlemen whose posts were deleted, please feel free to PM me and thank you to the members that brought this to my attention. To those who need to discuss what was deleted, please let us not try to get into the back door when the front door is closed for the evening.

Sam

Leisureguy · Post by **Leisureguy** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 6:43 pm

I mentioned above how ads once had to have either only caucasians or, if non-caucasians were pictured, they had to be in subservient roles. Nowadays, fully integrated ads are so common as not to even be particularly noticeable.

And I do believe that I've seen some ads that show a mix of straight and gay couples---interesting how ads start/reflect the transition.

Post by **drmoss_ca** » Tue Jul 21, 2009 1:59 am

I do wish you lot would grow up and understand that whatever your personal views, in this forum we treat expressions of homophobia exactly as we would anti-semitism or racism. Those who don't like that know what to do. Now carry on.

Chris

Cigar Dan · Post by **Cigar Dan** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:56 am

diggity wrote:I really don't see any gay tones in their advertising or item descriptions. Their newsletter on the other hand is a bit different, but whatever. The heart of the matter is that they are located in an area in San Francisco that does have a lot of homosexuals, however, the store itself is quite professional and doesn't promote any type of sexuality. They are quite professional, knowledgeable about their products, and do make some mean soap and laundry detergent.... Plus, who really cares? One could say that this whole shaving business is very metrosexual anyway...I mean...collecting shave soap and cream like it's going out of business!

I have never felt my heterosexuality compromised by the fact that I like a number of Nancy Boy products. Sure, my wife has ribbed me about it a little, but all in good fun.

A few years ago, I was attending a conference in San Francisco. The Nancy Boy store was a bit of a walk, but I wanted to pick up some more shaving cream and bar soap. The staff was extremely helpful and friendly, and as is their custom, threw in some lagniappe. Their dedication to customer service is second to none.

While I enjoyed my visit to the store, I have to admit that I felt a little conspicuous walking back to the hotel carrying a shopping bag with a large blue and yellow daisy on it. Oh well, I got over it.

Dave T · Post by **Dave T** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:17 am

drmoss_ca wrote:I do wish you lot would grow up and understand that whatever your personal views, in this forum we treat expressions of homophobia exactly as we would anti-semitism or racism. Those who don't like that know what to do. Now carry on.

Chris

I would support banning people making overtly racist and anti-semitic comments as well as anyone making negative gay comments, such as slurs, gay bashing, homophobic distress, etc.

Dave

Churchill · Post by **Churchill** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:08 am

[/quote]

I would support banning people making overtly racist and anti-semitic comments as well as anyone making negative gay comments, such as slurs, gay bashing, homophobic distress, etc.

Dave[/quote]

Although I do not understand why anyone would want to delve into these subjects on a shaving forum and I realize this is a privately run forum,
I hate to see people banned for expressing their views.But I also realize that not very many share my view of total freedom of speech as long as it doesn't directly cause physical harm (yelling "fire" in a crowded theather).

Dave T · Post by **Dave T** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 7:38 am

Churchill wrote:

I would support banning people making overtly racist and anti-semitic comments as well as anyone making negative gay comments, such as slurs, gay bashing, homophobic distress, etc.

Dave[/quote]

Although I do not understand why anyone would want to delve into these subjects on a shaving forum and I realize this is a privately run forum,
I hate to see people banned for expressing their views.But I also realize that not very many share my view of total freedom of speech as long as it doesn't directly cause physical harm (yelling "fire" in a crowded theather).[/quote]

It's the ignorance and hate underlying racism, anti-semitism, and anti-gay views that is harmful, and it doesn't need to dirty these forums. Things don't need to cause physical harm to make them wrong.

Dave

Churchill · Post by **Churchill** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:00 am

While I agree that they don't belong on this forum you shouldn't stop someone from expressing their views. No matter what I believe is right or wrong the real harm comes in supressing speech to fit certain ideals. That being said,if this was my forum I wouldn't want it on here either as this is not the place. But I don't think banning would be fair without giving a person a warning about taking their discussion to a more proper place.

Hoos · Post by **Hoos** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:33 am

Personally, as I've always viewed this as a gentleman's forum, I prefer sticking to gentlemanly topics.

The WWW is a big, open place. With plenty of other places where one can express one's personal, political, or other beliefs. Either rationally or emotionally. I belong to some of them. And that's where I vent my issues/concerns over more emotional topics than which soap to use today. Though choice of soap can be problematic at times.

I've always found SMF to be an island of calm, free from axe-grinding. Hopefully, IMHO, it will continue to be a bastion of gentlemanly behavior.