re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

What is your opinion on fine shaving creams and hard soaps? Do you like Trumpers, Coates, Taylors, Truefitt & Hill? Post your reviews and opinions here!
Post Reply
brothers
Posts: 20905
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by brothers »

Today it was announced by Fine Accoutrements that the 100 year old European company that has been making their shaving soap - same soap base as Tabac - has closed down their business and the widely popular soap is a thing of the past. It appears every vendor who carried it has virtually sold out all of their stock. Going fast would be an understatement. My favorite has been Snake Bite. Reportedly another ripple effect of 2020 problems. Fine says they've already made arrangements for a suitable replacement becoming available within a few months.
Gary

SOTD 99%: Every other day, soaps & creams, synthetic / boar / badger brushes, Colonial General razor, Kai & Schick blades, straight razors any time, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444
EL Alamein
Posts: 3004
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:55 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by EL Alamein »

Gary, wow that's disappointing. So you say it's the same base as Tabac but does that mean this firm that's closing also made Tabac? And if so, does that mean Tabac shaving soap is affected as well?

Chris
User avatar
Sam
M'Learned Friend
Posts: 11859
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:13 am
Location: memphis, tennessee
Contact:

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by Sam »

Following
User avatar
drmoss_ca
Admin
Posts: 10267
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 4:39 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by drmoss_ca »

"Je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothèse."
Pierre-Simon de Laplace
EL Alamein
Posts: 3004
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:55 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by EL Alamein »

I feel a panic hoarding coming on . . .

Chris
brothers
Posts: 20905
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by brothers »

EL Alamein wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:42 pm Gary, wow that's disappointing. So you say it's the same base as Tabac but does that mean this firm that's closing also made Tabac? And if so, does that mean Tabac shaving soap is affected as well?

Chris
Chris, I grabbed and inserted that short phrase from the email I received from Fine yesterday. They made a comment that they weren't completely unprepared for the decision to be announced, and had already started the search to locate another source. The factory closed down all production and will dismantle all of their equipment. I also had the thought about how it might impact Tabac. I was able to frantically locate only 2 pucks of Snake Bite, and today it looks like the soaps are all sold out except for a few Green and Fresh Vetiver soaps here and there.
Gary

SOTD 99%: Every other day, soaps & creams, synthetic / boar / badger brushes, Colonial General razor, Kai & Schick blades, straight razors any time, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444
User avatar
drmoss_ca
Admin
Posts: 10267
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 4:39 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by drmoss_ca »

Chris and Gary - note the edit to my post, made after I remembered there is a dedicated Tabac website, and not just the parent company of Maurer and Wirtz. I have sent a mail to M&W asking if they can clarify.
"Je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothèse."
Pierre-Simon de Laplace
User avatar
drmoss_ca
Admin
Posts: 10267
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 4:39 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by drmoss_ca »

No reply from M&W as yet.
"Je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothèse."
Pierre-Simon de Laplace
User avatar
TRBeck
Soapgeek
Posts: 5133
Joined: Sat Feb 23, 2008 1:59 pm
Location: Denver, CO

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by TRBeck »

This is how things are worded on the Fine Accoutrements website:

"When first formulating a shaving soap for the Fine brand, I set out with the singular purpose of matching the legendary lathering performance of Tabac. After unsuccessful attempts to work with just about every large soap producer in the US, I eventually expanded my search to Europe, where, to my surprise, I found I could actually procure the same soap base used by Tabac! Not long after, Fine Classic Shaving soap was born."

I have long wondered about the "same-as-Tabac" claim. The soap packaging for Fine soaps explicitly says "Made in the Netherlands," whereas Tabac is "made in Germany." Further, the wording above doesn't indicate that the soap is the same as Tabac, although it comes close. It's very carefully worded: what is meant by soap base? Many companies buy a soap base and then "adjust" it to produce their finished soaps. Having used Tabac and Fine quite a bit, both are excellent, but Tabac's lather is more profuse and more hydrated. I have suspected this is carefully worded marketing puffery for some time.

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalli-Werke - Dalli is the parent company of Maurer & Wirtz

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Kappus - Kappus is the company that, I believe, manufactures the soap base for Fine, although the soap base may be tweaked in the Netherlands, finished with scent and milling and the Fine logo stamping, etc....I suppose it's possible they make the base that Dalli buys and finishes in Germany as Tabac soap.

Anyway, all that to say, I am not panicking, but it probably never hurts to hedge one's bets.
Regards,
Tim

Why should we not meet, not always as dyspeptics, to tell our bad dreams, but sometimes as eupeptics, to congratulate each other on the ever-glorious morning? - Henry David Thoreau
EL Alamein
Posts: 3004
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 7:55 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by EL Alamein »

Tim, thanks for the perspective. It sounds like the most probable scenario.

Honestly, I'm not worried though as I hedged my bets long ago.

I would be surprised if Tabac dropped it's shaving soap because the soap base purveyor went under. I imagine they sell enough that they would have a contingency supplier in any situation. After all they sell bath soap and shaving stick soap etc as well. They probably do a respectable business with regards to soap.

Who knows what will happen in these strange times. I just hope they can keep producing their excellent shaving soaps.

Chris
CMur12
Posts: 7222
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:41 pm
Location: Moses Lake, Washington, USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by CMur12 »

At the same time, we have seen many a famous soap change its source/reformulate for the worse. It has happened over and over again.

If another supplier is required, I would be very surprised if the soap base were identical to what it was before from another supplier.

- Murray
Give me Soap or give me death!
brothers
Posts: 20905
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by brothers »

Hypotheticals can be fun, for example - what if the shut-down was actually ignited by a notice to the supplier from M&W-Tabac that after a certain date M&W would no longer be a customer for whatever reason? Hmmm ---
Gary

SOTD 99%: Every other day, soaps & creams, synthetic / boar / badger brushes, Colonial General razor, Kai & Schick blades, straight razors any time, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444
User avatar
Shave4Fun
Posts: 3104
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:07 am
Location: Great State of Georgia, USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by Shave4Fun »

I just ordered a puck of Fine Accoutrements Classic Shaving Soap - Fresh Vetiver from an eBay vendor. It was the last one they had. :shock:

I sure hope TABAC does not go away, because I use it a lot.
Roger

I've been a wet shaver for 52 years!
User avatar
Shave4Fun
Posts: 3104
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:07 am
Location: Great State of Georgia, USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by Shave4Fun »

In 2007 I got serious about wet shaving with better products, and quality soaps were at the top of the list. As we all know, more and more people -especially men - got into a better shaving experience. So, naturally, people began to market more and more product options. Especially new soaps. Those of us who have followed shaving forums have learned what are good soaps and why. We probably could have made a fairly short list or the very best options here on SMF a few years back. And while that list would not be considerably longer now, I dare say that there are myriads of wet shavers who buy soap for price over doing research for better quality. (I cannot back that up except to say that I know people.) My thought then on companies closing, such as Fine, is the competition, which drives the markets. And in many cases of things like shaving soap, it is not the quality that sells, but the price. At any rate, if a company wants to keep the doors open, their products have to make a large enough profit.

Then there's Dollar Shave Club... what a joke. But people are buying the products.

I will keep using the best quality soaps that I can find, even if they are NOS.

BTW, Connaught has as good a price as anyone on TABAC soap.

Best,
Last edited by Shave4Fun on Wed Dec 02, 2020 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Roger

I've been a wet shaver for 52 years!
brothers
Posts: 20905
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by brothers »

In response to several inquiries regarding my source for the 2 pucks of Fine Snake Bite soap, I bought mine from QED Shaving. I've just checked this morning, and all of the scents are still showing in stock, except Snake Bite. The proprietor is Charles, one of the first to join SMF as a member many years ago.
Gary

SOTD 99%: Every other day, soaps & creams, synthetic / boar / badger brushes, Colonial General razor, Kai & Schick blades, straight razors any time, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444
User avatar
drmoss_ca
Admin
Posts: 10267
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 4:39 pm

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by drmoss_ca »

Well I never got a reply from Maurer and Wirtz. Not even a non-committal statement of the kind one might expect from a profit-oriented business.
"Je n'ai pas besoin de cette hypothèse."
Pierre-Simon de Laplace
brothers
Posts: 20905
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by brothers »

Fine has stated most recently that in just a few weeks there will be a new line of the Fine shaving soaps. The name is something along the lines of "Twenty First Century". They spoke highly of the characteristics, but did not mention any specific ingredients. There will be, or maybe there is already, a pre-order campaign.
Gary

SOTD 99%: Every other day, soaps & creams, synthetic / boar / badger brushes, Colonial General razor, Kai & Schick blades, straight razors any time, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444
User avatar
Shave4Fun
Posts: 3104
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2007 4:07 am
Location: Great State of Georgia, USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by Shave4Fun »

RE: TABAC

I recently purchased a new puck and the box is different, but the ingredients listed are the same as my older boxes (although not presented in the same order). So I am assuming it's the same soap. I did not open it because I use the older purchases first.
Roger

I've been a wet shaver for 52 years!
Bill_K
Posts: 184
Joined: Mon Feb 05, 2018 12:40 pm
Location: Red Deer, Alberta, Canada

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by Bill_K »

I've ordered two pucks of the "original" (as per the label) Tabac shaving soap. Not a panic purchase, as I was literally scraping the bottom of the bowl this morning.
Bill
brothers
Posts: 20905
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: re Fine Accoutrements tallow shaving soap

Post by brothers »

Just following up --- the company that went bankrupt did not and never has been associated in any way with Tabac. Maybe an obscure European brand, but nothing I've ever even heard of. There's no explanation as to why the guy at Fine even mentioned Tabac at all.

Furthermore, the new Fine shaving soap is a soft soap that costs about $25 and won't last anywhere as long as a hard triple milled soap. Of course he'll try to put a positive spin on the whole thing, and I understand that. Bottom line: we've lost another great tallow based triple milled shaving soap. One of the fragrances that are permanently discontinued was the Green Vetiver that is/was the only vetiver-related soap I've ever been able to use, based on the fragrance. The new line of soaps does contain tallow, for what it's worth. So what? I've got plenty of others to take its place when my Fine soaps run out in about 10 years now that I only shave 3 or 4 times a week.
Gary

SOTD 99%: Every other day, soaps & creams, synthetic / boar / badger brushes, Colonial General razor, Kai & Schick blades, straight razors any time, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444
Post Reply