Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

What is your opinion on fine shaving creams and hard soaps? Do you like Trumpers, Coates, Taylors, Truefitt & Hill? Post your reviews and opinions here!
OleDub
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:56 am

Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by OleDub » Wed Jul 31, 2013 12:30 pm

I got 4 pucks of Trumpers soap, 2 with box, 2 without, on a deal on Mankind. I normally use creams as I have dry skin. However I love the GFT soap fragrances: Rose, Lime, Coconut and almond. I have trouble lathering this soap compared to my Harris Lavender and TOBS coconut. I get a very thin lather unless I keep going with it and I need my Woodhead bowl to help proceedings. I have used my Commodore, BK8 and vulfix 2234 and get the same result. The strange thing is the lather seems to dissipate after about 15 seconds of being on my face. Can anybody enlighten me as to what is going on? Am I missing something?
John the 'Dub

User avatar
Squire
Squadron Leader
Posts: 18970
Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:41 pm
Location: North East, MS

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Squire » Wed Jul 31, 2013 2:31 pm

Try using less water.
Regards,
Squire

brothers
Posts: 20153
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by brothers » Wed Jul 31, 2013 4:19 pm

John, it's probably not anything you're doing wrong. There's been some discussion about the same thing happening to a lot of guys. Depending on how old your GFT soap is, the formulae are different, and getting worse. Some guys have become disgusted with the poor lather. It's a shame because if it would make a great lather, we'd all be using it a lot. You're right about the fragrances. They're very good. Since you have these soaps, and obviously want to use them, try (as Squire says) using less water and/or more soap. As an experiment, try loading a lot more soap on the brush and see what happens.
Gary

SOTD 99%: 12 soaps & creams, SilkSmoke synthetic, General V2 by Colonial razors, Kai & Schick, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444 asb

User avatar
Craig_From_Cincy
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:38 pm
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Craig_From_Cincy » Wed Jul 31, 2013 8:04 pm

As Gary wrote, the Trumper soaps being made today are awfulm they are being made by a firm in Glasgow called Soapworks, who also make equally awful soaps for Penhaligon's, Truefitt and Crabtree. They are as bad as anything that's on the market, simply unlatherable. The scents are wonderful, you might consider them as bath soaps, albeit expensive ones.
Cheers,

Craig

bernards66
Duke of Silvertip!
Posts: 27408
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:02 pm

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by bernards66 » Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:43 pm

Craig, Soooo....the culprit is this Glasgow outfit called 'Soapworks' is it? THEY are the villians who produce those dreadful unlatherable hard soaps? And now Trumpers too have engaged these....these....criminals?! Good God!....in heaven's name, WHY? Surely these firms must actually TRY these soaps at some point and realize that they're hopeless...that there's no way that anyone who knows anything about traditional shaving is going to bother with such nonsense. I really just don't get it as there are other firms in Britain who could make them a fine shave soap...as, in fact, firms have been doing for companies like Trumper for decades now. It's really dumb if they're just trying to save a few pennies per cake.
Regards,
Gordon

User avatar
Craig_From_Cincy
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:38 pm
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Craig_From_Cincy » Wed Jul 31, 2013 10:45 pm

Gordon,

This one firm is singlehadedly nearly ruining the British shave soap industry. I'm not kidding about that.

It's posted in more detail on the 2nd page of this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=52294&start=20

This firm, Soapworks, purchased the business of the firm that made Trumpers et al for some time, Standard Soap Company. Soapworks had not, apparently, ever made shave soaps prior to the Jan 2012 purchase of Standard, and it shows. They ONLY use vegetable bases, mainly palm oils, to make soaps. Period. These folks should be run out of the shave soap business on a proverbial rail. They are making overpriced garbage.

Another discovery from that thread, Broad Oak Toiletries who manufactures Floris soaps, is actually the sister company of Floris, so they are at least keeping manufacture of their soaps in their own family.
Cheers,

Craig

OleDub
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:56 am

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by OleDub » Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:46 am

brothers wrote: As an experiment, try loading a lot more soap on the brush and see what happens.

Actually, it makes no difference Gary. No matter what combo of water/soap/air you try (or hard/soft brush for that matter) the lather just disappears in seconds. I have to say it is bizarre. Caveat Emptor. I should have done my research. I'm not much of a brand hound, but I made the false assumption that because of the heritage the product is good. A logical fallacy. I'm not buying any more of their products. If anybody is interested, here's how to make the most of Trumper's soap:

1. Don't load too much water on the brush.
2. After loading from the puck, keep going, AND AT THIS POINT ADD MORE WATER.
3. Use a proper lathering bowl (again bizarrely this really helped). I used my Woodhead lathering bowl instead of my Ikea Bamboo.
4. Use a preshave oil,and.. TA DA..
5. Add your favourite unscented cream (mine was AOS) for a superlather.

You'll get a good shave, and still enjoy the excellent scents from these poor soaps.

I'm jinxed when it comes to soaps. I bought one from Fitjar and paid a fortune for shipping. Their creams are excellent, but I wound up shampooing the dog with the soap. I was just outside Paris last week and bought a L'Occitance bowl of what I thought was Cade soap, but it was an empty bowl, I kid you not.

However I am having a lot of luck with I coloniali Mango croap, more later.
John the 'Dub

Thalay Sagar
Posts: 4438
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:14 am
Location: Roanoke, Virginia
Contact:

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Thalay Sagar » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:24 am

John, I'm no fan of the modern Trumper's soaps, so I am not trying to defend the product. However, I have found that the soap is very sensitive to hard water. If you have that problem, you can try using distilled water (a pain, I know). Otherwise, there is always the BST. Bummer about the Fitjar soap, the original tallow recipe worked very well for me.
Best,
Chris

“Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?”
― Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

bernards66
Duke of Silvertip!
Posts: 27408
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:02 pm

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by bernards66 » Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:41 am

Craig, I see. Well, that's just jolly...sigh. That Standard Soap Co. used to make the old T&H soaps which,as you know, were quite good. Still, surely Trumper et al. have other options in Britain, Bronnley for example? They MUST know by now that these soaps are unuseable...how long do they think they can keep selling crap like that at those prices I wonder? Interesting about that Floris connection because, as I've mentioned, Floris always made their own soaps and, I guess, in a sense they still do.
Regards,
Gordon

DGB452
Posts: 659
Joined: Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:06 am

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by DGB452 » Thu Aug 01, 2013 2:34 pm

Bronnley soaps are made by Soapworks too and quite a lot of others :wink:

http://www.soapworksltd.co.uk/our-clients

OleDub
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:56 am

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by OleDub » Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:07 pm

Thalay Sagar wrote: I have found that the soap is very sensitive to hard water. If you have that problem, you can try using distilled water (a pain, I know). Otherwise, there is always the BST. Bummer about the Fitjar soap, the original tallow recipe worked very well for me.
This is something I never thought of Chris. I'll get a bottle of distilled water and do a comparison with my tap water. However, in relation to GFT I'll go along with the consensus. I love the lime and violet enough to keep them and use them with an unscented cream in a superlather. Pity, great scents. Ditto with Fitjar, great cream, shame about the soap.

I had a similar problem with Ogalla, but solved that with a BK8 and the constant addition of water while lathering. Not so with Trumpers and I would have to agree with the folks here.

Actually as my technique gets better, I'm beginning to get as close a shave with my creams as I do with soap. The big exclusion being WMF, I can't best it, though it does leave my skin dry.
John the 'Dub

User avatar
Craig_From_Cincy
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:38 pm
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Craig_From_Cincy » Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:54 pm

bernards66 wrote:Craig, I see. Well, that's just jolly...sigh. That Standard Soap Co. used to make the old T&H soaps which,as you know, were quite good. Still, surely Trumper et al. have other options in Britain, Bronnley for example? They MUST know by now that these soaps are unuseable...how long do they think they can keep selling crap like that at those prices I wonder? Interesting about that Floris connection because, as I've mentioned, Floris always made their own soaps and, I guess, in a sense the still do.
Regards,
Gordon
Gordon,
These forms would be better off outsourcing their shave soap production to Valobra, as Czech & Speake have done with their soaps. They wouldn't say 'made in the UK any longer, but they would be very good quality soaps that are worthy of the prices being charged for them. If they wanted to keep production in the UK I hear tell that Scottish Fine Soaps of Falkirk produces serviceable veggie based shave soaps, that are at least a notch above what Soapworks produces.
Cheers,

Craig

bernards66
Duke of Silvertip!
Posts: 27408
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:02 pm

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by bernards66 » Thu Aug 01, 2013 10:11 pm

Craig, Yes, the Scottish Fine Soaps shave soap is at least useable...I tried one speciman maybe around three years ago I believe. But you're right, if there really is no other alternative in Britain anymore ( as that dreadful list of Soapworks clients seems to suggest ) then Valobra, or maybe Mettler's in Switzerland, or whoever actually makes the Tabac shave soap....or almost ANYBODY would be the better alternative. Oh, and a...somebody makes the D R Harris's shave soaps afterall...what about them? Those clowns in Glasgow MUST be capable of making a better shave soap if they wanted to...this whole thing is just incomprehensible...as well as ghastly.
Regards,
Gordon

User avatar
Craig_From_Cincy
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:38 pm
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Craig_From_Cincy » Thu Aug 01, 2013 11:10 pm

Gordon,

The persistent rumor I read on shave forums is that Harris continues to make their own soaps at a facility they own in one of the London boroughs. Who knows if its true. A poster at B&B claimed to have talked to someone from Harris within the past year and claims the Harris people said they are very aware what has happened to their competitor's soaps and (he claims) won't allow the same fate to befall their soaps. Here's hoping that's true.
Cheers,

Craig

brothers
Posts: 20153
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2008 7:18 am
Location: Oklahoma City USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by brothers » Fri Aug 02, 2013 5:24 am

It must be all about the money. I can't think of any other reason these firms would all jump on board, apparently with not a care in the world about the fact they're killing the market for their shaving soaps.
Gary

SOTD 99%: 12 soaps & creams, SilkSmoke synthetic, General V2 by Colonial razors, Kai & Schick, Superior 70 aftershave splash + menthol + 444 asb

User avatar
Squire
Squadron Leader
Posts: 18970
Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:41 pm
Location: North East, MS

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Squire » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:19 am

Obviously shave soap isn't high on their list of concerns.
Regards,
Squire

User avatar
Sam
M'Learned Friend
Posts: 11736
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:13 am
Location: memphis, tennessee
Contact:

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Sam » Fri Aug 02, 2013 7:02 am

I dont use shave soaps but maybe 3, 4 years ago, I finished up a Trumper Sandalwood. Loved the scent and well, I have half a pot left of Coates Sandalwood shave cream. Just finished up my Trumper limes. I am tempted to just order a few tubes of the Coates Sandalwood and a half dozen limes that are being offered. Reading what I have read, I think Id only get Tabac shave soap if I returned to soap

Crag
Posts: 436
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 8:31 pm
Location: Perris, Ca USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Crag » Fri Aug 02, 2013 12:30 pm

John,

Sorry but it sounds like you gotten the crappy new formulation GFT soaps...They are terrible at lathering...I was extremely saddened when i found this out...i had been using GFT Violet for 10 years in one form or another and got my auto-shipment last year and the soap was worthless...I've gone to my second choice of DR Harris as compared to the old formulation GFT. These are acceptable soaps, but do not rival the older GFT formulation GFT in terms of scent and latherability.

I've also recently found The Body Shoppe Maca Root Cream, which I think for the money spent is outstanding. I did have some success lather the GFT by adding cremo cream and a bit og glycerine to the mix before I whipped it up but the lather was marginal at best.

I'm really sorry for your loss!

Matt
Matt

"The 'Path of least resistance' is what makes rivers and Men crooked."
--Ezra Taft Benson

OleDub
Posts: 36
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:56 am

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by OleDub » Fri Aug 02, 2013 3:48 pm

Thanks Matt,

As I mentioned above, a super lather with my AOS unscented cream has saved the day (and about 80 euros worth of soap). You live and learn. I am absolutely astounded that an age old house like Trumpers would blow their reputation on an outsourced product. To me, it's a bit like Cartier outsourcing to Swarovski or Patek to Tag. I don't get it. Looks like the bean counters got their way in a round of cost cutting. Anyway it's a good excuse to check out the Harris scents.
John the 'Dub

User avatar
Craig_From_Cincy
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:38 pm
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA

Re: Need avice on lathering Trumpers soap.

Post by Craig_From_Cincy » Fri Aug 02, 2013 7:33 pm

Crag wrote:John,

Sorry but it sounds like you gotten the crappy new formulation GFT soaps...They are terrible at lathering...I was extremely saddened when i found this out...i had been using GFT Violet for 10 years in one form or another and got my auto-shipment last year and the soap was worthless...I've gone to my second choice of DR Harris as compared to the old formulation GFT. These are acceptable soaps, but do not rival the older GFT formulation GFT in terms of scent and latherability.

I've also recently found The Body Shoppe Maca Root Cream, which I think for the money spent is outstanding. I did have some success lather the GFT by adding cremo cream and a bit og glycerine to the mix before I whipped it up but the lather was marginal at best.

I'm really sorry for your loss!

Matt
Matt,

The newly launched Eucris soap was the first one that Soapworks made for Trumper. I recall how stunned everyone was at its awful performance. As Trumper depleted existing stocks of its soaps, one by one, they were replaced by the awful Soapworks reformulations. Looks like they got around to ruining the Violet soap sometime last year, as you discovered.
Cheers,

Craig

Post Reply