Washing before shaving when using a cream

baldchin · Post by **baldchin** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 1:01 am

I always wash my beard extra thoroughly before shaving. I've never liked the thought of moving a sharp blade over dirty skin. YMMV

Post by **drmoss_ca** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 4:10 am

I find I get a closer and more comfortable shave if I wash first. In fact I use fairly hot water and good soap (Floris) and rub it well into my beard, almost as if trying to work up lather without the benefit of a brush. Then I leave it soaking in while I prepare the lather in the scuttle. Once this is done I rinse and lather with a brush. This gives the best beard softening I can achieve - better than an application of hair conditioner - and harks back to the barber's last hot towel placed on top of a coating of lather.
Having said all that, I fully respect Gordon's finding that it is better for him not to do any of this. Horses for courses.

Chris

Sue · Post by **Sue** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 6:32 am

So, it boils down to try different techniques, then stick with what works best for you and your skin type. Right?
Sue

Gweezemeister · Post by **Gweezemeister** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:38 am

Sometimes I like to do something I was forced to do in the reserves (please! no weekend warrior jokes!!!

On a dry face simply apply the wet lather which is worked in and then painted on. I work up the lather (usually KMF or Proraso) in an enamel or melamine camping mug). I have done this with a superbadger but also got a good wet lather in no time with the long black handled Omega barbershop brush . The lather is left on the face. I run a finger across to guage the potential glide factor and sometimes even massage it with my fingers. I then reapply by painting it on (the mug is essential for me as it produces limitless lather especially when I use KMF)

At 40 this method works exceptionally well for me. At 21 in the fields around Petawawa this method (can of foam and twin blades) tore me to pieces.

But most times, I just splash some water. I now prefer shaving before I go to bed and shower in the morning. The 5o clock shadow swings in at around 3ish.
Andy

RueTheDay · Post by **RueTheDay** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:45 am

Wash your face before you shave for two reasons:

1. Your natural skin oil is not a good lubricant. Rub the side of your nose with your index finger, then rub the tips of your index finger and thumb together and you will see what I mean.

2. As someone else said, the oil and grime will prevent the shaving cream from properly penetrating and softening your beard. In effect, the shaving cream itself (which is mostly soap to begin with) will do the job of washing your face and once soap had emulsified oil it lose the properties of soap.

vespergo · Post by **vespergo** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 9:11 am

This is very interesting, there seems to be an equal amount of people on both sides of the "wash the face" fence. I'm definately on the side of not washing the face, or at least if doing so do it with a mild soap.

This morning I didn't wash my face (as usual) and didn't even shampoo, because in the past nine months while DE shaving I noticed a different shave when not shampooing and plus I don't like to strip my hair of it's oils everyday. I just washed the T zone on my face and lathered up and shaved at the sink. The lather was merangue like very smooth as usual but not too much water to where it starts to move like water. Using KMF I find that it's very easy to get a great lather (it does have propylene glycol which if i remember correctly is a greater humectant than glycerin, which does a very good job at holding extra water). Still with a couple skips per side of the face... so still there is another factor. Since there are several variables at play I decided to think of anything that I've changed and came up with something very intriguing and I think that it's the actual culprit though not intuitive.

Before I got Taylors, ARKO, KMF, and Tom's (the SCAD bug) this past week, I had already bought Palmolive about a month ago and Proraso about 6 months ago. I had used both of these before with no problems in skipping of the razor. None whatsoever. The only reason I haven't used them recently is because they both left some sort of slight residue that a few hours down the road my skin didn't agree with, so I left them and went back to the soap. But as I've mentioned before I bought the creams because winter season is coming and I don't feel like dry skin all season (and most moisturizers wreak havoc on me) in fact my hands will break out into hives if I put any lotion containing fragrances on them.

Okay, so to the point... The other factor that I changed was that I'm now using Olive oil soap by Olivia Care that I picked up in TJ Maxx for pretty cheap, it was on clearance. But the stuff is awesome. It's pretty much the only soap that I've tried that pulls a nice balance of double duty between getting you clean and keeping you moisturized all in one. Which is great for me because I can't stand using a moisturizer. I changed soaps around the time that I noticed the skipping... also that happened to be the same time I started using creams. It kinda made me feel that the problems were with the creams, in actuality I bet it's with the soap. The soap I use in the shower to wash the T zone, but more importantly at night I wash my entire face with it. It makes my face kinda rubbery (if you know what i mean), hard to explain but definately there. I've actually shaved with it before and it left my face very moisturized but with a rubbery feel to it. I'm not sure if anyone else has experienced this effect, but it's a very REAL effect with this soap. And you know what happens when rubber and the smooth head of the LH Merkur meet.. it grabs it and won't let go... thus skipping. If the head doesn't touch... no skipping.

So tonight I'm going to use my old soap at the sink and in the shower tomorrow, use my old soap. Then shave as normal and see if that's the culprit, but I'm quite certain that it is. If so, this will be a very interesting point that I haven't seen much of on the forum, something not used during prep causing an effect on the shave(i know it's been mentioned before, but i find it is overlooked probably more often).

bernards66 · Post by **bernards66** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 2:09 pm

Sue, Yeah, that's pretty well it, with most of this shave stuff. In the end, there is no substitute for personal experiance, as there is no 'one right way' and no 'the best product' for eveyone. There are just too many factors at work, in a seemingly simple thing like shaving the face. There are certainly some proceedures and products that work better for more men then others, but that's about as far as it goes. You can see this very clearly in the entirely different proceedures that I and Chris M. use, prior to the actual shave. What each of us do is based on a lot of personal experiance with our own skin and beard, and they're clearly not the same.
Regards,
Gordon

bernards66 · Post by **bernards66** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 2:20 pm

Josh, By George, I think you may have nailed it. This is one of those 'missing elements' to the story, that I referred to above. Yes, the olive oil soap may be the cause of the 'skipping'. When I tried using olive oil, Marseilles type soaps to shave with ( like the Enchante 'Cube' for example ), I always got a lot of the razor skip effect. Soaps of this type really do take most of the natural oils out of the skin, so, even though you lathered up afterwards, you were not getting as much lubrication as you were used to, before you started using the olive oil soap to wash with. Let us know, if this turns out to be it.
Regards,
Gordon

JimT · Post by **JimT** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 2:23 pm

Chris,

"I find I get a closer and more comfortable shave if I wash first."

I agree.

JimT

Leisureguy · Post by **Leisureguy** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:18 pm

Also, if I moving a sharp blade around my face, I want the skin to be very clean indeed.

bernards66 · Post by **bernards66** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 3:47 pm

The only real issue ( and it's a personal one, to be discovered by experimentation ) is whether by soap washing one's face beforehand, one improves the shave by further softening the whiskers and removing any possible tiny 'impediments', or, whether doing so strips off too much of the protective natural oils, resulting in an unnecessarily harsh or irritating shave. I happen to fall into the second catagory.
Regards,
Gordon

fisherc · Post by **fisherc** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:36 pm

http://www.melogy.com/Images/scans/H_2004_1.jpg

rafikz · Post by **rafikz** » Sun Oct 01, 2006 8:49 pm

Gordon , I am in the second category as well ; as I said, I just wash the non-beard area

fisherc Very interesting article, thanks

Gweezemeister · Post by **Gweezemeister** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 4:18 am

The article makes complete sense to me. It certainly explains why my face looks and behaves better when I shave without showering as oppossed when I do shower shave combo.
Andy

Post by **ichabod** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 8:25 am

I never wash my face before shaving. I splash with hot water, then apply lather, and often leave it for a minute or more each pass to enable it to do its magic.
Unless I am specifically trying to remove something grimy from my face, I never wash it with soap but rather splash it with water. It's worked all these years, and I'm reluctant to mess with whatever balance my skin has attained.

vespergo · Post by **vespergo** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 9:51 am

Gordon, the hypothesis about the soap that I was using, Olivia Care, to wash with (making my skin rubbery) and making my blade skip is 100% correct. Last night I washed with the old soap I usually use and this morning washed the T zone in the shower. Then lathered up some KMF, using a couple squirts and building plenty of lather. I usually just use one pump and it works fine but when you just start a new bottle the first pump is like half a pump or less, so I chose two. Lathered up my face and shaved, no skipping whatsoever!

So something that is not seemingly connected to blade skippage can be a factor when shaving. The thing that set me off to this is that I noticed that the Olivia Care soap made my skin feel really moisturized, but also rubbery at the same time.

Thank you everyone who has chimed in about this. It's really helped me with the creams, and actually answered the other question, "is washing really necessary for the beard area?" In my case, no. The lather does a good enough job of cleaning the area.

vespergo · Post by **vespergo** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 9:57 am

Dominic, you just splash your face with hot water at night and in the shower? But no washing of the forehead or nose... Interesting, I might try that at night, just to see what happens. Soap at night works fine for me, but i'll check into this and see how it works for me, maybe my face doesn't need a washing at night either, just hot water.

Post by **ichabod** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 10:29 am

vespergo wrote:Dominic, you just splash your face with hot water at night and in the shower? But no washing of the forehead or nose... Interesting, I might try that at night, just to see what happens. Soap at night works fine for me, but i'll check into this and see how it works for me, maybe my face doesn't need a washing at night either, just hot water.

Exactly. I've never found a soap (I admit I haven't tried very many) that didn't make my skin feel dry and tight. I feel like the "if it ain't broke" adage applies for me.

bernards66 · Post by **bernards66** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 11:16 am

Josh, Personally, I do soap the 'T zone', but only once a day, in the shower, but I use high quality tallow based bath soaps, so, that may be the difference between Dominic and myself. Either way, it's best not to overdo the face washing thing. Glad you solved the 'skipping' problem.
Regards,
Gordon

Blue As A Jewel · Post by **Blue As A Jewel** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 1:32 pm

I tried not washing my face for a while, but found i got better shaves when I did. So now I wash with soap and finish my shower with Sharp's Daily Foaming Scrub. It contains bentonite clay which leaves a slickness behind - good prep for the shave.