Shedder?

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Sun May 27, 2012 5:28 pm

I'm interested in tapping into the SMF fountain of knowledge and experience regarding the average brush's worst nightmare. For this discussion, I'm thinking of a guy who's happy with a particular brush, but after using it regularly over a period of several months or more, the hairs continue to fall out almost every time. Maybe as few as one, maybe 3 or 4 per shave.

What causes a brush to shed? Is the cause related to something in the manufacturing, or something the user is doing or failing to do that contributes to the continued loss of the badger hair?

Is there anything that can be done to stop or slow it down? What eventually happens if the guy keeps using it and the brush keeps giving up one or more hairs every time?

In your experience, what eventually happens, and how long will the true shedder last before you're left with an unusable brush?

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Sun May 27, 2012 6:39 pm

So far, I've read a lot of archived discussions, and here's one remark posted by Dave:

notthesharpest wrote:Possible user errors:

Heat (any hotter than hot tap water), especially having a heat source close to the brush

Chemicals of any kind

Violent physical treatment

Constantly soaking the glue in water for long periods of time (I'm not really sure if this is a problem, but I think it might potentially be, so I added it)

... that's about it, as far as I can tell ...

Squire · Post by **Squire** » Sun May 27, 2012 6:45 pm

Gary I've never had a brush that shed but if I got one I would send it back. Any reputable dealer should make it right.

jww · Post by **jww** » Sun May 27, 2012 6:56 pm

I only use skeleton style brushes -- my hair is quite curly and bristle based brushes don't work well with it.

My issue is having to clean the skeleton brush regularly.

Squire · Post by **Squire** » Sun May 27, 2012 7:28 pm

Always knew you had style Wendell.

greyhawk · Post by **greyhawk** » Sun May 27, 2012 8:29 pm

I've had one shedder. It dropped a few hairs every shave, and when I went to sell it, I wanted to make sure it was OK.
Using thumb and forefinger, I reached into the knot and gently squeezed while I pulled out. (This was done quite gingerly and not at all aggressively.) I got a few hairs almost every time, and then got a big hunk with some glue at the bottom. It was obvious there was a big issue.
I think the problem, at least with this one, was in the manufacturing of the knot. It appears the hairs were not "anchored", or set deep enough, into the glue properly, or not enough glue was used.

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Mon May 28, 2012 7:19 am

This morning I decided to take a close look at the brush while it's dry and fluffy, and noticed a tiny area where there were one or two hairs peeking out over the tops of all the other hairs.

I gently pinched and pulled, and out they came, one at time. I continued pinching and pulling all over the tips of the hair, and the only area where they seem to want to come out is in that single isolated region. They just continued to come out with no effort on my part, one after another, until it appears that no more seem to want to turn loose there, at least for today. There must have been 10 or 12 hairs by the time they stopped falling out.

This tells me the hairs are not coming out all over the place, but are limited to a single tiny isolated area. Maybe that will be the good news in all of this.

This brush is unique and replacement is virtually impossible, so there's no option of casting the problem onto someone else, unfortunately. I'm going to keep using it with gusto and see what happens. It is my hope that the little area where the hairs are not securely glued in place will eventually exhaust itself, if it hasn't already. Maybe there was an isolated bubble or a spot of poorly mixed or applied glue.

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Mon May 28, 2012 7:26 am

Wendell, I am very familiar with the kind of shedding you are experiencing! But sadly, I don't know what a skeleton brush is. I'm guessing a pad or cloth that might serve better to polish the dome of a skeleton's head, rather than a brush with bristles, with nothing up there that wants to be combed, as it's all fallen out already! Am I close?

jww · Post by **jww** » Mon May 28, 2012 8:55 am

Skeleton brush pic for reference purposes. They are great -- leaving the hair with a neat, but not too perfectly quaffed look.

I have been using the same black skeleton brush for years now -- and I do mean years -- at least 15 or more. I still got meself plenty of head-top follicles, even at my advanced middle age

To be fair, I don't even have to brush my hair - just running my hands through it after it's wet does the trick.

You gents shouldda seen me in the 70s when I had something of an afro ..... my kids still like to look at the yearbook pics and family photos as full-on entertainment from time to time (like every Christmas, for example).

Squire · Post by **Squire** » Mon May 28, 2012 1:30 pm

Same here Wendell, kids are like that. I'd replace them but I already have too much invested.

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Mon May 28, 2012 1:42 pm

A brief reflection back to the brush that started all this commotion. After plucking out the doomed group of hairs who happened to have been planted in poisoned ground this morning, the routine daily shave resulted in zero additional losses. First time in a long time. Maybe I've seen the last of the problem. This scare has already had me starting the search for a replacement. Maybe I won't have to replace it now. Time will tell.

When the kids look back at the pictures of me in the past, I'm always blown away by how young and handsome I used to be! No regrets there!

PS, if an old picture happens to have captured my beautiful wife, that's even better. Dang it, I was indeed a lucky guy! Still am!

jss · Post by **jss** » Tue May 29, 2012 12:45 am

Gary..Glad to hear a settling has taken place..We do love our tools..We're happy for you...

Best,
Julian

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Tue May 29, 2012 6:22 am

Julian, thanks for the words of support, but unfortunately, this morning was probably the most dramatic incident of hair loss ever.

Here are the facts: Rooney Finest, knot size 29mm X 69mm. Never used, since it was made about 4 years ago. I received this brush from Mr. Lee Sabini 2 months ago. Hair loss has accelerated for about a month.

Yesterday, about a dozen hairs came out before the shave, but none during, hence, my comment about a hope of resolution. Today, it's a new day, and a bad day for this particular brush.

Another dozen hairs fell out before and during the shave, and afterward during the rinse and before wiping with a dry towel, a large clump of about 20 to 30 hairs came popping out, and the roots are still set in the gray glue that held them in place. I've kept the clump because it's a shocking sight to behold.

Summary of today's events: I've sent an email to Mr. Sabini asking him for some suggestions. I do not want to give up this brush. I love it, and it's mine! If I could get it reknotted in something as close as possible to the original Finest knot, that would be perfect.

LouisIII · Post by **LouisIII** » Tue May 29, 2012 7:51 am

Irreplaceable indeed

Fingers crossed it magically stops Gary.

jss · Post by **jss** » Tue May 29, 2012 1:34 pm

Gary..I'm sure I speak for others too, hope Mr. Sabini has a remedy or a suitable replacement..Please keep us posted....

Best,
Julian

greyhawk · Post by **greyhawk** » Tue May 29, 2012 2:14 pm

jss wrote:Gary..I'm sure I speak for others too, hope Mr. Sabini has a remedy or a suitable replacement..Please keep us posted....

Best,
Julian

Lee stands behind his products. Make sure to contact him and let us know what happens.

brothers · Post by **brothers** » Tue May 29, 2012 3:22 pm

Mr. Sabini went above and beyond earlier this year when he was able to help me secure this brush, and I know he'll be as disappointed as I am when he learns what's happened. I'm prepared to pay for the remedy, if he can help me figure out what that might be.

AFG · Post by **AFG** » Tue May 29, 2012 3:54 pm

Lee does stand behind his products. I bought a brush from him in March that was a heavy shedder from the beginning and he promptly replaced it. Most shedders seem to lose hairs right from the beggining but others can begin shedding some months after they had been put to use. I gave my son a two band Simpson T2 about 18 months ago. It was fine at first but a couple of weeks ago the entire center section of the knot just came loose. Simpson would do nothing about it as the brush was only warranted for 12 months. I understand a company has to draw the line in the sand at some point but I know my son well enough to know that he was very careful with the care he gave this brush and I am not happy with Simpson's response given the number of brushes I have bought from them.Keep in mind this brush did not see daily use as he has several other brushes.It's unlikey either of us will buy another from Simpson. Buy enough brushes and you are likely to eventually run into a shedder and you can only hope the company is willing to do the right thing and stand behind their product.

Nitrox · Post by **Nitrox** » Tue May 29, 2012 5:23 pm

I've had a couple of shedders as well. One was a Rooney which the vendor replaced no questions asked, and the other was an M&F brush. Lee remedied the situation to my satisfaction, and I'm sure he will do the same with you Gary.

never2close · Post by **never2close** » Tue May 29, 2012 8:16 pm

I've had 2 shedders. The first was a Vulfix that Lee (Lee's Razors) promptly replaced, and the second was a Shavemac VLB that committed suicide. I gave it one shake to expel excess water after my shave one morning and the whole knot flew out of the handle. I didn't bother to seek redress, instead I unceremoniously discarded it.

I feel your pain with respect to the Finest. It is not a matter that is easily rectified since it is quite difficult to replace. Good luck.